Starting up the Fusor Lab - thoughts and issues

Reflections on fusion history, current events, and predictions for the 'fusion powered future.
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Dennis P Brown
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Starting up the Fusor Lab - thoughts and issues

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Not unlike Richard, it is time I fired up the fusor and cooked up some neutrons. I really want to test my new Ludlum 2000 with two BF3's, and my (still not working!) He3 detector tube I have and certainly need to test. However, these are just some of the projects on my "To do List".

First, I will be upgrading my shielding. I hope to replace my 30 kV power supply and use an 80 kV supply in the near future. That means the X-ray danger then becomes very serious. Following this logic, I intend to install an array of dosimeters and then test my ionization chamber detector, as well. One does need to verify the threat and not just assume all will be well. Like a fusor's voltage, radiation is unforgiving.

Next, add a dedicated moderator system for my neutron detectors. I seriously underestimated the proper size. I see people are using far more than I ever thought necessary. This forum is very useful once again.

Assemble a new Geiger tube - my old one died after many years of service. They only last so long. Naked tubes are inexpensive and creating a full probe is rather simple. Also, allows one to match their preferred BNC system. :)


The following is totally unrelated to fusors but very important for those interested in a dedicated building.

First off, its a good time to consider doing such a project: that is, if you ever really thought you'd need/want one. The weather is warming, lumber prices are not insane and will only be going up in the future. So, right now is the best time to do this if you really are seriously considering such a future project.

Since I built my lab building a few years ago I would like to say a few things in passing for those considering this type of project (a good idea when one does fusion in a more serious manner. Better still, safer for family members.)

I built my building to match an old foundation I laid down years before for other reasons. Major mistake. One never has enough room and I seriously regret that I didn't build it up to the max allowed by code (before one needs a building permit. Do check that so no one shows up and tells you to tear it down.) I can't believe how quickly one fills all available floor space. I needed an extra table (small) and had to really struggle to rearrange the lab to make enough space. I guess any building is never big enough once it is there to be occupied. Glad I have a real attic in it (do consider that especially for smaller builds.) I really use that to store a lot of currently unneeded equipment.

In any lab one never has enough storage space. So, don't forget shelves - never enough of these either. Always try to add more than you think you'll ever need when planning (and this enable's one to know where to tie in shelve hangers before any walls get covered.)

Also, the primary work bench will, again, never be big enough. Over build that for sure - and add drawers! Maybe a dedicated shelf over it (invaluable.)

Don't forget power: I have a 240 service outlet and double outlets every four feet on all walls. While extension cords with multiple outlets are often needed one really wants as few of them as possible. Yes, a proper breaker box is essential for a separate building (one must follow code for installation.) Also, any out door power wires for the building should be underground and in sealed piping for both their protection and general safety.

Don't forget room lighting: don't over look this. I have two large diode light systems in the ceiling and a portable light.

Finally, security (depends also on your location.) My main door is metal clad, has a dead bolt and the building's windows are too small for anyone to get through. Many of us end up with a lot of equipment and it is a good idea to design the building with these ideas in mind. Also, this prevents curious neighborhood children from accidentally creating issues.

Aside: Well, this post is not technically 'Fusion future' (except for me) but I didn't want to displace some more interesting posts currently in the forum so I placed this here. ;)
Last edited by Dennis P Brown on Sun May 07, 2023 6:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Richard Hull
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Re: Starting up the Fusor Lab - thoughts and issues

Post by Richard Hull »

Dennis is correct and suffered all the "first pass" fusion lab/experimenters lab/man cave issues.

Hindsight is 20/20. Take all of his notes to heart. Read and take heed.

My main lab was built onto my existing home in 1989 that effectively doubled the floor space on the home. The 20X34 was added and attached to my home. Accessed only from outside! Later, added a 16X12 outdoor overhanging roof shelter with long, high lab bench for outdoor demos. I outgrew the entire facility even after adding a 20X34 attic space over head in 2004!

I wisely contacted my county building regulators office and found I could add up to a 20X12 approved, portable outbuilding with no building permit.

As I have a lot of wood working materials and power tools with the associated dust from it in my big lab, I decided to add a woodworking building for that purpose only in 2014. I went to a local portable outbuilding supply facility and ordered a 20X12 wood outbuilding with a single steel door, no windows at all. The building was custom built by the Amish in Pennsylvania and shipped down to the place I ordered it from. That company then delivered the building to my home. They tore up my chain link fence to my back yard, moved the building into place, leveled it width solid large cinder blocks, re-installed the fencing and left.

The total cost was Just under $4000. The building did not contain one single sheet of chip board or particle board! All the flooring, walls and roof were normal plywood, all 2X4s were on 16 inch centers. the roof was of a "barn" style allowing for a decent attic area to be added. The shingles were architecture type for long life. Great build by those Amish!!

I went to work wiring every 4 foot outlets. I added an attic with extra 2X6 cross members to super strength the building. Put in a wood rack and 3 tool benches. Some photos below. As of may 2023, it too, is now full to capacity.

As the Brits would say..."mind how you go" and once you go...."mustn't grumble"

Richard Hull
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Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment
Matt_Gibson
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Re: Starting up the Fusor Lab - thoughts and issues

Post by Matt_Gibson »

Glad to see another considering upgrades. I’m contemplating a 240v service for my office/lab. My power supply is consistently pulling more than 15A from my 20A breaker…Fortunately, the room is adjacent to the beaker panel :-)

-Matt
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Starting up the Fusor Lab - thoughts and issues

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Richard is correct, pre-fab and contractor install is definitely the way to go as long as one accepts paying some more but certainly that saves a LOT of time and hassle.

Building a lab as a DIY isn't a weekend job for sure. Just prepping the site (leveling), much creating a pad/or foundation (try mixing concrete by hand!) is no simple matter. Still, it has its merits (sore back, realizing how rough construction people have it - just to name two benefits off the top of my head.)

As Richard correctly pointed out - size is everything and certainly check your local reg's but always build the max allowed (as I learned :( ). I guarantee you'll use all the space and need more.

As Matt mentions, power is the main reason for a lab so again, no cutting corners there.

Issues like insulation, AC/heat, water (for specific needs), and finishing the interior (for those that like that sort of thing (me)), add further complexities and need to be considered. If one has moderate building skills and wants to tackle such a project, then a battery operated drill, and chop saw are the two essentials tools besides std hand tools. For a real 10 x 20 ft slab, either get that done by pro's or learn concrete block work and how to lay down a proper footer (again - follow code for footers!)
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Richard Hull
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Re: Starting up the Fusor Lab - thoughts and issues

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I have not insulated either my big lab or the 12X20 newer outbuilding. 240 at 80 amps was setup for the large building in 1989! Tesla coil work that regularly ran reversed pole transformers at 16 kilowatts was the norm for Nemesis. The wood building only has 120 volt 30 amp service as nothing but power tools are used their.

Winter monthly HEAS meetings are heated in the large lab building with a "sunflower" propane heater and two oil radiators. The 10 or more regular monthly attendees huddle around those sources of heat and keep quite warm seated in chairs and stools. Great camaraderie! The same goes for when I work in either building during limited periods of cold.

Fortunately, prior to 1989, I established a lab/library/tool area taking over the entire upstairs of my home. Robot/TCBOR meetings were held up there from about 1980-89. Before the big lab was built, I had 240 60 amp service pulled to the upstairs lab for Tesla work!!

Normal wives would never allow a husband to create a man cave/lab taking over the entire upstairs of a home. Thankfully I married well and not normal. No kids helped a lot. More money and goodies just for us. I have been doing and making things happen all of my life. Earliest serious nuclear and chemical work at age 10.

Some of the upstairs lab shots from 1989 (color) and early 1980's B&W shots as well.

Richard Hull
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Robot1.anno.jpg
library.anno.jpg
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Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Starting up the Fusor Lab - thoughts and issues

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Your wife is certainly tolerant especially during HEAS when so many overrun your Homestead! We all appreciate the hospitality, for sure.

As for power, just a suggestion that when someone installs service, might as well have 240; some heavy duty equipment requires it but I'd guess that's rare for fusors.

Yes, Black & white before the invention of color ... lol.

One question, who is that young guy in the picture you supplied ;)
Dan Knapp
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Re: Starting up the Fusor Lab - thoughts and issues

Post by Dan Knapp »

There was mention of building as large as possible not requiring a permit. I would argue not to let the permit issue be a limiter. Bite the bullet and get a permit to build as large as you can afford. I hired a contractor to put my lab building under roof and then spent several years finishing it myself. I built a two story building disguised as a two car garage with an upstairs. I framed in an elevator shaft and used a jet ski lift as an elevator. With the elevator, I was able to move material and cabinetry upstairs single handed. A Harbor Freight hydraulic lift table was also key to installing wall cabinets single handed. I obtained all my cabinetry by making a deal with a demolition contractor who was clearing labs at a university for a renovation. They typically smash the cabinetry into pieces small enough to haul out in a dump cart. I told the guy I could save him some money by removing the cabinetry. His words, “Take anything you want as long as you don’t slow me down.”
I recommend installing HVAC using ductless heat pump units. You can buy them online with precharged Freon lines and install them without a Freon license. These are also the trick for retrofitting an existing building.
You can never build too big. I thought my shop was as big as I could ever need, then I started building a boat.
Dan Knapp
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Re: Starting up the Fusor Lab - thoughts and issues

Post by Dan Knapp »

One further thought. If you live near the coast, consider the floor elevation. I built my lab/shop building in a period of very low hurricane activity and wasn’t considering elevation. The cycle changed, and now I’m regularly faced with sandbagging when a storm approaches. A few loads of fill to raise the floor level would have saved me a huge effort in sandbagging.
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Starting up the Fusor Lab - thoughts and issues

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Sounds really impressive. You really should share some pics.

I agree that going all out (for good reasons) makes sense in such cases where one can justify a large-scale dedicated building. Through for the average fusor user that dreams of a separate place for their work (rather than a corner of a household room), a low cost 'upgraded shed' has a lot of appeal.
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