Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

This forum is for specialized infomation important to the construction and safe operation of the high voltage electrical supplies and related circuitry needed for fusor operation.
User avatar
Richard Hull
Moderator
Posts: 14949
Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2001 9:44 am
Real name: Richard Hull

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by Richard Hull »

Vince, Sounds like you have tried to trick the Glassman into doing what it was designed to stay away from.
All the best in getting the monster on order to do what it is rated to do.

Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment
User avatar
vince_Darmancier
Posts: 42
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:04 am
Real name: Vince Darmancier

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by vince_Darmancier »

Update,
My unit seem to have bigger problems than the usual fuse, jumpers, light bulb and cable connections ..
It does power up but the fans stay silent. All the fuses are good and so is the interlock. I suspect a relay of some sort although I can hear them clicking on and off when power is applied. All the knobs are responsive and feel tight (new) I am only missing a single light bulb in the front panel and Spellman wants me to ship it back to them which I am (very) reluctant to do. I even installed the recommended bulb for the "x-ray on" in the back of the unit where the interlock is .. any ideas?
Attachments
17075114390607786248588978492993.jpg
X rays on
X rays on
17075113365271481238907452125171.jpg
User avatar
Dennis P Brown
Posts: 3118
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 10:46 am
Real name: Dennis Brown

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by Dennis P Brown »

If Spellman wants it shipped back - is that for warranty work or you having them look at it for $$$? If the former, best not to touch it (break seals which could invalidate the warranty.)
User avatar
vince_Darmancier
Posts: 42
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:04 am
Real name: Vince Darmancier

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by vince_Darmancier »

Oh there is no warranty! It's an ebay find...
I already opened it to check the fuses anyway.
I want to tear it down further because I feel like an internal fuse is blown,
I would really hate to spend $$$ for a fuse you know . Especially if I can fix it myself.
When I first turned it on the fan briefly turned on but I did not hear any pop....
Matt_Gibson
Posts: 494
Joined: Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:36 am
Real name: Matt Gibson

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by Matt_Gibson »

Hope you didn’t pay big $$$$. I don’t know where these eBay sellers get off selling these as-is at the prices I see…

These are usually a royal pain to deal with…They get dumped onto eBay when they are near death. I wasted many weeks on a Glassman and then built my own.

-Matt
User avatar
vince_Darmancier
Posts: 42
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:04 am
Real name: Vince Darmancier

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by vince_Darmancier »

No. I didn't. Again, it was an ebay find.

The underbelly revealed nothing useful. No fuses no relay, no broken connection. Just capacitors that looks brand new and some heavy duty switches. No burn marks, no swollen caps, no leakage...nothing ..
Everything looks like it could be brand new or have seen very little use.
Nothing is obviously broken or otherwise OOS..
The interlock is fine and all the display works... Meaning no error.
This really baffles me ! It must be some IC or a very tiny connection.. i'll post updates when I get them.
JoeBallantyne
Posts: 298
Joined: Tue Jul 20, 2010 4:08 pm
Real name: Joe Ballantyne
Location: Redmond, WA

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by JoeBallantyne »

Some old supplies will not output HV if the indicator lights are burned out.

I would suggest making sure that all the lights you have in the supply work correctly, and are not burned out.

I have some old Universal Voltronics supplies, and the HV will not work if either the power light, or the HV on indicator light, are burned out.

This was intentional, as a safety feature.

If HV went on the LIGHT saying so was ON, guaranteed.

If the light was off, even if it was off because it was burned out, there was NO HV, also guaranteed.

The lights on these old supplies do actually matter, if you want them to output HV.

Joe.
User avatar
vince_Darmancier
Posts: 42
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:04 am
Real name: Vince Darmancier

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by vince_Darmancier »

Yes I saw the other post about the lights.
That`s one of the first thing I did! I also contacted Jorgue Pena at Spellman.
he did not seem overly concerned about 1 light being out on the "power on"
push button, instead he delivered a useless corporate speech about how Spellman will
take a look and do the best of investigation with the best technician in a professional manner etc....
These are the smallest light bulb I have ever seen measuring 5mm wide, running on 24 V DC.
Not a chance in hell to find it at any retail store and the only good electronic/ham store in my area has closed
down recently (electronic connection in Westland MI)
So I guess I`ll try to find another unit with similar switch but I hate to buy a $600 power supply for a damn switch.
Although I hate to send my unit to Spellman even more...
Anyway, thanks for your time and advices, I`ll post some update as they come..
Nep
User avatar
Joe Gayo
Posts: 403
Joined: Sun Jan 06, 2019 9:34 pm
Real name: Joe Gayo
Location: USA

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by Joe Gayo »

Do you have a schematic?

You probably don't need a light bulb, just something that will draw enough current to emulate it. This could be a resistor.

Good Luck, Joe
User avatar
Dennis P Brown
Posts: 3118
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 10:46 am
Real name: Dennis Brown

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Joe is correct - you absolutely need a schematic of the supply. Also, proper equipment to evaluate the various circuits and chips (std ones; obviously, custom chips are for the company only). Otherwise, buying any electronics w/o testing is a disaster (I discovered on a x-fomer.)

Don't lose faith - I have managed to fix a few electronic devices black boxes using schematics and I have near zero skills with stuff like that. But sometimes, an easy to diagnose component is the fault and easy to replace/fix.

Don't buy more junk hoping to try and use parts from one to fix the other - you need to know exactly what's wrong or else you end up with two non-working devices that have failed for different reasons.
Matt_Gibson
Posts: 494
Joined: Thu Sep 23, 2021 10:36 am
Real name: Matt Gibson

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by Matt_Gibson »

Worst case scenario is you wind up with a really nice high voltage transformer and possibly multiplier and metering to use towards a homemade option.

-Matt
User avatar
Richard Hull
Moderator
Posts: 14949
Joined: Fri Jun 15, 2001 9:44 am
Real name: Richard Hull

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by Richard Hull »

Reverse engineering is great and works for the electronically adroit in this case. However, it seems to fail if you are trying to reverse engineer an alien spacecraft. No luck here yet.....I think?

Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment
User avatar
Dennis P Brown
Posts: 3118
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 10:46 am
Real name: Dennis Brown

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by Dennis P Brown »

I have an old glassman that (of course) is positive output; however, like Matt said, it is a great power supply for initial parts (easily pushes 50 kV.) Been on my to-do list for awhile but building my own multiplier for negative operation shouldn't be a big task (not gonna disassemble their sub-unit multiple if I can avoid that task.) For $10 (plus shipping) I couldn't pass it up. But it works, has only analog displays and only a single interlock jumper required to bypass. Far easier to work on. But having a working analog based device makes a 'home build' vastly easier.
User avatar
vince_Darmancier
Posts: 42
Joined: Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:04 am
Real name: Vince Darmancier

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by vince_Darmancier »

I admit I only covered the very basic based on what I could read on this forum, I did not find the schematic ye but that does not mean it`s not out there somewhere.. As Richard pointed out, electronic can be overwhelming for me at times but I`ve managed to get by so far.. I might need a little more time than others.
This is not a complicated device and almost everything is fairly easily accessible from the top, so I should be able navigate the wires.
I notice a power outlet in the back, according to the manual this is the "WFS" option for Water Flow Signal.. there is very little from the manual as to what this does and no power is coming out of it.

From page 22:
"220Vac water flow signal is switched with
POWER ON. The standard configuration is
switched with X-RAY ON. This option is not
available with FSI (220V)."

To be honest I have no idea what this means. I suspect some sort of water cooler gets its power (or signal) from there?
I don`t think this would prevent the unit from powering up though, or would it ?
Seems like it should get power when the unit is switched on and it does not. so that could be a clue..
Anyway, thanks again! I`ll get the schematic...

I did get a few neutrons this weekend using the old Glassman on my new fusor chamber.. So not a completely wasted time!
User avatar
Dennis P Brown
Posts: 3118
Joined: Sun May 20, 2012 10:46 am
Real name: Dennis Brown

Re: Spellman DF3 Power Supply Fusor Application

Post by Dennis P Brown »

That sounds like a protective interlock signal to prevent operation of the target without proper water flow. It might need to be addressed. Sounds more like an interlock for the water supply rather than your Glassman but who knows?
Post Reply

Return to “High Voltage - Fusor Input Power (& FAQs)”