Can we make a star? NIF
Re: Can we make a star? NIF
There is one aspect of a plasma tokamak (very small 't') that is both missed by the fission breeder community and even most fusion 'experts' - ITER the future piece of extremely costly junk ... I mean research reactor, can produce enough fission fuel to supply ten regular nuclear fission reactors with fuel per year when it is is operated in its normal pulsed mode and a very low level blanket of low grade fuel is surrounding it. ITER compares very well to the fact that it takes ten breeder fission reactors (filled with a lot of highly dangerous Pu that can lead to run away fission explosion) in order to supply just one other reactor per year with fuel.
- Chris Bradley
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Re: Can we make a star? NIF
Dennis Brown wrote:
> There is one aspect of a plasma tokamak (very small 't') that is both missed by the fission breeder community and even most fusion 'experts' ...can produce enough fission fuel to supply ten regular nuclear fission reactors
How does a tokamak produce fissile material? never heard that one before.
> There is one aspect of a plasma tokamak (very small 't') that is both missed by the fission breeder community and even most fusion 'experts' ...can produce enough fission fuel to supply ten regular nuclear fission reactors
How does a tokamak produce fissile material? never heard that one before.
- Rich Feldman
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Re: Can we make a star? NIF
In 2009 I attended a technical seminar presented by a director of NIF. (Now that the facility has been dedicated, the program is technically NIC, the National Ignition Campaign).
The show included official marketing concept of utility-scale power from laser-driven D-T implosions, and the associated fuel cycle. The tritium was bred from lithium in neutron capture blanket. Most of the total power was from fission of neutron-irradiated waste from fission reactors -- "destroy the waste by burning it for power".
I asked why that wouldn't have, as a limiting natural resource, mine-able lithium deposits. Which are already in great demand for electrochemical batteries. IIRC the answer was dismissive.
The show included official marketing concept of utility-scale power from laser-driven D-T implosions, and the associated fuel cycle. The tritium was bred from lithium in neutron capture blanket. Most of the total power was from fission of neutron-irradiated waste from fission reactors -- "destroy the waste by burning it for power".
I asked why that wouldn't have, as a limiting natural resource, mine-able lithium deposits. Which are already in great demand for electrochemical batteries. IIRC the answer was dismissive.
All models are wrong; some models are useful. -- George Box
- Richard Hull
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Re: Can we make a star? NIF
All the above is correct. Dennis had the best overall view. The real winner here is our strategic stockpile stewardship program. Better weapons through better and more secretive testing. Lighter, more easily deliverable, efficient and effective thermo-nuclear weapons. After all, as the devil spoke to Don Juan in G.B. Shaw's Man and Super Man, "Man's heart is in his weapons."
The ignition bit is for the public polish on the nuclear stockpile stewardship apple.
No real power here.....nothing to see here.........keep moving along, please......nothing to see..........watch your step lady..........Hey, buddy, don't touch that; keep in line, please...... have a nice day folks.
Richard Hull
The ignition bit is for the public polish on the nuclear stockpile stewardship apple.
No real power here.....nothing to see here.........keep moving along, please......nothing to see..........watch your step lady..........Hey, buddy, don't touch that; keep in line, please...... have a nice day folks.
Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment
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Re: Can we make a star? NIF
My understanding (assuming any decent ignition is attained) is that a laser fusion device would have to pop off about 10 times a second in order to generate grid-worthy power. I doubt that the current setup could attain 10pops/day. The optics would probably give out some place during the first 10 pops, anyway. Each explosion would be the equivalent of a stick or two of dynamite, so you'd need the much-vaunted circulating lithium blanket for a shock absorber as well as for neutron recovery/tritium breeding. I haven't seen any concerted development effort for that blanket, just some words and some "artist's conceptions".
For weapons testing, one pop every week or two would be the bee's knees.
For weapons testing, one pop every week or two would be the bee's knees.
- Richard Hull
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Re: Can we make a star? NIF
Long ago, I gave a complete report along with URL's related to the NIF debacle in mid-stream as congressional and GAO probes got launched.
So horribly dismayed were the weaponeers who were counting on a fixed "use" date and NIF startup for idea testing that they found a large number of workarounds to test a number of their ideas at other labs. As time went on and delays continued, many weaponeers actually started to question the value of the entire project, having found so many workarounds in the interim.
Now that NIF is, ostensibly, up and running, the weaponeers are happy, at last and the PR department remains the longest fully staffed section at the site. We all await yet more claims of wonderment and fusion power while the real business conducted there gets the big red "Top Secret" stamp on all reports.
Richard Hull
So horribly dismayed were the weaponeers who were counting on a fixed "use" date and NIF startup for idea testing that they found a large number of workarounds to test a number of their ideas at other labs. As time went on and delays continued, many weaponeers actually started to question the value of the entire project, having found so many workarounds in the interim.
Now that NIF is, ostensibly, up and running, the weaponeers are happy, at last and the PR department remains the longest fully staffed section at the site. We all await yet more claims of wonderment and fusion power while the real business conducted there gets the big red "Top Secret" stamp on all reports.
Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment