Research facility construction

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Bob Reite
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Bob Reite »

Unless Nick figures out how to replicate Doug's "Gonzo" mode and will need a lot of neutron shielding.
The more reactive the materials, the more spectacular the failures.
The testing isn't over until the prototype is destroyed.
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Wow, underground! That's serious fusion work, indeed.

My more humble future shed/glorified research facility finally has a real base to build upon - literally. Due to limits on the orgianl start on the foundation, the building will be 9 ft by 12 ft. As can be seen in the photo I've finished the foundation (ugh) and installed the floor. All underside lumber has been painted - just ran out of paint so not all the upper floor is painted yet. Of course, the walls/windows/door, roof and many services will need to still be done but having a square, level and solid foundation & floor are the essential first steps to build an above ground ( ;) ) facility. Of course, it is well away from the house so if by some chance, I too get a strange flair I think it being above ground will be ok - just maybe not for the operator ( ;) )

Interestingly (to no one, really) I ran out of all my treated lumber, screws, wood glue and cement finishing this thing - wish I could claim excellent planning but obviously, the exact opposite is really the truth; cutting things that close is almost always a recipe for aggravating extra trips to the lumber store; too often, repeat ones at that.
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Foundation with installed floor; built to take some weight
Foundation with installed floor; built to take some weight
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

OK, more progress - got the walls partly up and hung the door. So it is coming together - glad the heat and humdity weren't killers today. I'll add the windows tomorrow if I have time and weather permits. I decided to go with extra high ceilings - both for equipment room, and ease to install outer wall panels (being lazy helps.) Once more, after I got more screws (and paint) I started work and after getting to this point - had one screw left - again, not planning correctly. Next time - jumbo size. Still, reached my limit on construction, anyway.
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The building is taking shape
The building is taking shape
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Further progress - walls are complete; need a roof (wood, shingles, vinyl siding) and add windows. Then paint and the exterior is essentially finished. That is a lot still to do but progress is how it gets done.
Need to get the roof mostly up tomorrow before it rains - not likely (the former, not the later.)
Decided on a pitch to make roof beams easy to cut - must admit, this building phase was far harder than I thought but went more smoothly than I expected. So, guess the roof will be the opposite; through I recently replace half the roof on my home (all new beams, panels besides shingles) so I consider myself a bit more experienced in that area of building. Guess that means I will have a really hard time.
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Building, foundation and no roof
Building, foundation and no roof
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Richard Hull
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Richard Hull »

Great work, thus far! You may come to regret not putting up the roof trusses first. With weather, I think I would have done the roof first at least to the tar felting covering. In that manner, you can continue work in the rain and shingle last. Wiring is typically last, but that is a matter of choice as is all construction when done by an individual. Out of curiosity, what anchors your base 2X4s to the concrete? I looked for the classic high strength, "L" bolt anchors typically set into the concrete, but could not seem to locate them in the image.

Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Both good points and catches - I see you are an old hand in construction.

The reason I delayed the roof structure is I felt that I had to strengthen the wood frame first by installing the wall panels for shear strengthening. I was concerned that the then frame structure might have trouble handling the roof weight without the wall panels installed. However, the remaining stud work and the panel install took far longer than I thought and was more difficult. So my plan to get the roof up that day was beyond me. I'm not sixty anymore and just can't handle 12 hours of constant construction in the sun like I use too. ;)

Another issue, when I finished the remaining concrete work the previous week, having no design yet for the building other then size (being trained as a physicist (concepts), rather than an engineer (designer), I do tend to have that issue in my projects.) As such, I had no idea where the door (or even the door type; singel/double or both!) would be located and this would impact my anchor locations. So currently the building has no standard anchors at all - I just glued the wood to the concrete in a few places (using the special concrete glue they sell.)

I do have proper anchors on hand but these are the type that must have holes drilled into the concrete first. I absolutely dread doing that type of work (the impact drills are murder on me). So I put that task on hold. Having proper anchors near the doorway is essential and will have to be addressed. Also, much of the foundation was laid years ago so I did not install any anchors then since I didn't have any specific building plan at that time (also, I wanted to park cars on it for car repairs. Anchors would be an issue.)

I will build the roof frame today and hopefully get it covered before it rains tonight; but I really need to anchor the frame this week - the building is well shielded from any winds via many small trees too close. So for now, that isn't a critical job till the roof is covered by panels.
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Well, the roof is up (no shingles and no significant tar paper - just the crown.) Far too much in a day. Thank goodness I have scaffolding - without the inside and outside stuff it would have been far too difficult to complete in a day.

No more for a few days as I recover ... . Too much hard labor for these few days time but I did beat the weather. If it was a kit, been far easier and much faster but I was too cheap to spring for that ...not sure now if that was a good idea; no, definitly would not do that again. Precut kits are worth it.

Hopefully, the weekend will be ok and I can then do the shingles and anchor system.
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Roof system - far from leak proof but will do for now
Roof system - far from leak proof but will do for now
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Richard Hull
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Richard Hull »

Good work! Now pray for no significant sustained winds or heavy gusts until you have the building firmly anchored into the concrete.

Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment
John Futter
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by John Futter »

Dennis
I do not want to hear you say
"We are not in Kansas now Toto"

maybe a bolt or two to stop it going to Oz
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

LOL - no winds so far; I'll anchor this weekend.

Well, weather cleared and I managed to do half the roof (tar paper, edge trim and shingles)- the half in the (mostly) shade; otherwise, I think I'd have melted. The other half waits till better weather (clouds!)

A bird was none to happy with me - they wanted it as a possible nesting site; told them it was to be closed up too soon for that to work. They're spoiled since I feed them and do provide nesting sites. Ditto for the Chipmonks but at least they just want to use my rock retainer walls to raise their young. Maybe I'll name the second Chipmonk "Toto, too" ... ;)

Besides giving me a place to get my fusors up and running, along with my laminate research, I've learned a valuable lesson constructing this 'facility' - I had planed on building a small semi-glassed enclosure addition to my home for morning breakfasts. NOT happening!
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First half of the roof shingled - more area than I thought ...brutal when the Sun came out
First half of the roof shingled - more area than I thought ...brutal when the Sun came out
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Well, finished the roof just in time. Started to rain as I did the last row of shingles. Nice compared to the earlier sunshine. Thunder started as I finished - luckily, computers track lighting and cells.

Tomorrow, I'll anchor the place and start on installing one of the two window assemblies. Then I plan on trenching and installing the 220/50 amp power line via std plastic piping.

Hopefully, I'll also Install the breaker box tomorrow.

I have a large LED light - so a ceiling will be up after these tasks tomorrow; hopefully, by next week I'll have all the wall insulation, and wiring installed with outlets/switches and have power/lights.
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Shingles are done so I have a dry work area to use
Shingles are done so I have a dry work area to use
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Bob Reite
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Bob Reite »

You still have that area above the door to get enclosed, as wind driven rain will still get inside at this point.
The more reactive the materials, the more spectacular the failures.
The testing isn't over until the prototype is destroyed.
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

You are correct but why I haven't yet covered those regions is that those are currently my best source of light for the interior. That is why I'm pushing so hard to install power and a light as well as one of the windows. I already have vinyl slats and wood panels to cover those openings as well as the side roof openings.

I will say that building this future 'research facility' is fun as far as doing something that is "science related". But till now I just didn't fully appreciated exactly how much finish work goes into building a remote house-like structure - like dry walling the ceiling and interior side walls nor about the heater/AC unit install much less the water - ugh. If it was to be a shed it would almost be done (except for your exact point.)

Update: Trenching done, 220 volt with its protective pipe enclosure installed. Grass reinstalled (lol.) Realize I need to paint the building before installing any windows or cutting/installing said power line through the wall, so that is next. Then window gets added; finally, anchors. If I am still able to move after cooking in the Sun, maybe start enclosing the roof areas. This research stuff was sure easier when I was a grad student and all I needed to do for experiments was get equipment, modify it and ready to go.

Next update: The building is painted and I added the first window. Working on the second one.
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Detail of power line (220 v AC; 50 amp cable from house)
Detail of power line (220 v AC; 50 amp cable from house)
Window on the south side for light and air flow (door is on north side.)
Window on the south side for light and air flow (door is on north side.)
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Well, between heavy rain and high temps/humdity finished enclosure work; the vinyl siding was more work than I remember the last time I used that stuff.

Need to work on framing the ceiling so I can install the room LED light, wiring, and switch but too hot right now. Breaker box is installed and wired into the main cable that connects to my home breaker box. Taking a break ....

Took down outside scaffolding and here is the south side.
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Southside; lower left side is the underground power cable in its housing entering the building
Southside; lower left side is the underground power cable in its housing entering the building
Final window installed as well; small but does have a screen
Final window installed as well; small but does have a screen
Research Facility exterior mostly complete; also need a door entry way platform
Research Facility exterior mostly complete; also need a door entry way platform
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Much of the ceiling framing is done (think I'll add a small 'attic' and access for storage.) Now that nearly all major outside construction is finished my rapid pace needs to end (also, just too sore ;) ). So, from this point I will work much more slowly building the interior - wiring/outlets, water access, insulation, dry wall, floor tiling, painting and environmental (AC/heat) install (that is still a long list! Thought I was nearly done building ... oh well.)

The difference between a shed and a real Research 'building' (even if it is just a larger size than most sheds) are the facilities inside; and that means a lot of extra work.

Since these installs will be spread out over a number of weeks and until finished, I see no point in anymore progress photo's until I get these essential but 'secondary' jobs done (besides, a few other projects that were sidelined due to this project and still need my attention, now, need to be addressed. Not everyone is happy I spent so many hours the last week or so focused on this sole project.)

Besides, I look forward to seeing other peoples fascinating projects and results here!
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

So after taking five days off I'm starting work on the interior of the facility. I've completed all wiring - including seven 120 v outlets, two ceiling light boxes and a two phase 220 volt outlet. Installed the LED lights with a switch so I have enough illumination in the room now to work. Next up is install the ceiling drywall panels (ugh) and start insulating all walls & ceiling; also (and this is really important since the building is a semi-hot box now, install the environmental system so I have AC!)
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The main breaker pannel and wiring; below is the 220 v outlet
The main breaker pannel and wiring; below is the 220 v outlet
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Well, the worst part is done - installed the ceiling dry wall and its insulation. Still need to finish the attic entrance but that will be tomorrow. I dreaded this part of the install but the scaffolding made the job relatively straight forward. One of the LED lights gave me a minor issue but that I'll fix tomorrow (doesn't respond to the off position of the switch). The research facility is starting to look real.

Can't wait to finish and install all my equipment; I'm especially interested in re-starting my abandoned deuterium accelerator, besides the fusor. I hope to add a small desk/study area but this building isn't exactly spacious (about 110 sq. ft.) and I have even more experimental equipment besides those mentioned.
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Dry wall ceiling in place and lights installed properly
Dry wall ceiling in place and lights installed properly
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Richard Hull
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Richard Hull »

Back in 2014 I bought a "portable building". I my county, such a building cannot exceed 280 square feet. The local company utilizes a Pennsylvania Dutch contractor to make all their custom, portable buildings over 140 square feet. My building was 12X20, (240 sq ft), with a barn roof that I specified. Those folks used no chip board, only solid plywood, (floors, walls and roof). All studs on 18-inch centers. The runners are treated 8X8's and vinyl siding and 30 year architectural shingles. The local company that sold me the building also took down a section of my chain link fence, moved in the building next to my lab, leveled the building on blocks, re-installed the fence all of this plus the building for $3400.

I wired the building. I also took full advantage of the barn roof, by installing 2X6 beams spanning and linking the upper runners and roof joints. To these, in alternation, I spanned with wood to create 4 ceiling storage areas. These 2X6's give tremendous cross bracing strength to an already superbly built building. I added a free, new air conditioner that a neighbor bought but never installed.

I looked at the kits and pre-built offerings at the local Lowes and Home depot. All chip board, 24 inch centers, etc. I would not accept these standards as a child's play house construction. It was worth a little more to have it done correctly using the right materials.

I attach some images.

Richard Hull
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Shop#4.jpg
Shop#3.jpg
Shop#2.jpg
Shop#1.jpg
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

That is one impressive build and very roomy. Craftmanship shows. A similar kit runs about $7.5 K (and no solid wood panels, of course), unassembled by the local major hardware store.
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Richard Hull
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Richard Hull »

I think that in 2014, I spent about an additional $400 on the interior. Notice I did not use wallboard but 1/2-inch plywood for interior walls. I spent less that $20 on all electrical work. I received about 100 old style fuses about 10 years ago. and a friend gave me an old fuse power box. I already had a lot of romex laying around. For lighting I just used ceiling mounted old Edison sockets and screwed in 60W equivalent white LED lamps.

Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
The more complex the idea put forward by the poor amateur, the more likely it will never see embodiment
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

I will be using drywall - easier and less expensive than wood panels.

I insulated the walls and will start drywall tomorrow. The heat is getting rather bad so I installed the environmetal system. It is a window unit that cools and heats; these are still much cheaper than the external systems. Besides, those types of heat pump systems require charging and that isn't something I want to take on right now.(Aside: below 40 F most heat pumps use electrical heating so not a big difference on these two units in performance except cost.)

This is no 240 sq. ft mini-house like Richard's (not even quite half that.) But will do for both my fusors and laminate research. I'll add some shelves to go along with the attic storage but this will be very limited on space. I wasn't up to building a foundation any bigger than the existing partial one.

All in all, I'm still under the kit cost even with the insulation, ceramic tiles, dry wall, electrical system and environmental system added to the materials cost; and I have enough materials leftover to build the washing machine room addition on my house. So, cost wise, not bad. But never again.
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Front with enviromental unit and doorway step
Front with enviromental unit and doorway step
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Bob Reite
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Bob Reite »

I've used those "Amish sheds" for radio site buildings. If you specify a residential type double door, they will be rodent proof, providing you send the $$ on proper entry bushings for antenna cables.
The more reactive the materials, the more spectacular the failures.
The testing isn't over until the prototype is destroyed.
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

After starting mine, I happen to pass a place that offered "Amish" sheds. Likely mine would still be cheaper (in both senses of the word ...) but too late to really consider.

Well, after the drywall install and spackling, I really realized that I'm happy with this smaller building - sheet rock installation is a bear. Still have to wait for it to dry before sanding. Then painting and finally, floor tile install. Hopefully, later this week, I can finally start moving equipment into it.
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Breaker box and 220 v outlet as well as normal 120 v outlets. I plan a semi-large glass melting furnace in that righthand side area for the 220
Breaker box and 220 v outlet as well as normal 120 v outlets. I plan a semi-large glass melting furnace in that righthand side area for the 220
Can see the attic access door in the upper right side ceiling; water pipe & drain pipe lower lefthand side on the wall (not hooked up yet.)
Can see the attic access door in the upper right side ceiling; water pipe & drain pipe lower lefthand side on the wall (not hooked up yet.)
Dan Knapp
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dan Knapp »

In reference to Richard’s post regarding a separate building for woodworking, I wanted to mention that it is possible to have a woodworking shop and a machine shop coexist with a good dust collection system. My shop is a two car garage space with machine shop on one side and woodworking on the other. I have a cyclone type dust collector in the corner with four inch ducts overhead and four inch corrugated hose drops. Slide valves make it easy to zone the dust collection to where you are working. The dust collection system was not cheap, but cheaper than a separate building. I originally looked at putting the dust collector outside, but opted to keep it inside to recirculate rather than dump conditioned air outside. This works well if you have a system with a HEPA filter stage on the output of your cyclone. I bought my system from Penn State Industries, but they don’t seem to sell them anymore.
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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Research facility construction

Post by Dennis P Brown »

Interesting because I debated on whether to install my blower motor for the glass furnace but in the end, decided I didn't need it; the glass is non-toxic (as are all my materials.)

Well, progress: the room is painted and now nearly fully tiled (except for a narrow last row but I ran out of floor adhesive.)

So I'm nearly there - still need to get more adhesive, and then grout/seal the tiles. Then it is done.

Yes, all white but I do need good illumination. When lab equipment and desks/benchs are in, the room won't be so white. I decided on ceramic tile since I will be using molten glass and a wood floor could lead to problems in the event of a small spill. Also, easier to keep the place clean; which is useful for the high vacuum work for the deuterium accelerator. Can't hurt for the fusor ;)
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20200707_122220.jpg
20200707_122157.jpg
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