Neutron Club Application- Zan Chaudhry

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Zan_Chaudhry
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Neutron Club Application- Zan Chaudhry

Post by Zan_Chaudhry » Thu May 19, 2016 7:38 pm

Hi, I am Zan Chaudhry, an eighth grade student (just turned 14) in Howard County Maryland, and I have actually already completed a fusor. I'm just really into physics in general (experimental and theoretical of all types, but especially particle and nuclear). I built this completely on my own, but with funding from my parents. Most of my stuff is from eBay, but some of it comes from vacuum companies, some from my dad (he owns a medical equipment company), and the deuterium from my local Praxair distributor (really nice people) who happened to have a deuterium cylinder in stock and were willing to sell it to me; everyone else gave me a really hard time, especially Sigma Aldrich :(. I'm really sorry that I didn't join earlier, so I have not posted the images from earlier stages, but I can post them if they are needed. I just finished on Sunday and had the following data:
The test was carried out over a ten minute period.
Voltage:
~16.25 KV
Amperage:
~30 mA
Pressure:
I had a few different pressures, but mostly around 14 microns or 22 microns (my two main pressures at different times over 10 mins.)
Neutrons:
My 3He detector was having issues, so it would turn off after 30 seconds, but in that 30 seconds I had a neutron count of 646, so if it had run for the whole minute it would have been around 1,292 cpm. I repeated this a few times and got similar results (anywhere from 387 to 690 in 30 seconds, the average being around 650).

My pictures are attached. I also included an air plasma image at 35 micron (without diff pump, which I achieved earlier). If you have any doubts I have a full video too. Really excited to have done something like this :)!!
Attachments
Poissor.png
Neutrons.png
Gauge.png
Fusor with me.JPG
Fusor setup.png
Diff pump.png
Air Plasma.png

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Richard Hull
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Re: Neutron Club Application- Zan Chaudhry

Post by Richard Hull » Thu May 19, 2016 8:44 pm

The count sounds a far too high for the voltage and current and pressure. I am deeply concerned about your settings related to the detection levle on the 3He tube.
The 3He tube will barely detect anything at 20kv.

You need to state a background count

You will need to run your fusor with the tube in and out of the moderator.

We need a lot more data.

Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
Retired now...Doing only what I want and not what I should...every day is a saturday.

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Zan_Chaudhry
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Re: Neutron Club Application- Zan Chaudhry

Post by Zan_Chaudhry » Thu May 19, 2016 9:29 pm

Hi Mr. Hull,

I ran a background before the test and got (average) 24 cpm. I just ran a background count for 30 seconds (I talked about the issues with my detector). I got 36 cpm and attached the video. The other fusor runs, in and out of moderater, I will post soon.

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Zan_Chaudhry
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Re: Neutron Club Application- Zan Chaudhry

Post by Zan_Chaudhry » Thu May 19, 2016 10:39 pm

I tried to attach the video file but I can't upload mov files. So I have uploaded the file to onedrive and here is the link.

https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=1 ... ideo%2c3gp

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Nick Peskosky
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Re: Neutron Club Application- Zan Chaudhry

Post by Nick Peskosky » Fri May 20, 2016 1:14 pm

Zan,

Your background counts seem extremely high for an He-3 detector of the size shown in the attached images. With a moderator you would expect somewhere in the ballpark of 2-5 cpm depending on your geographic location and altitude. I'd recommend checking the tube against a strong Gamma emitter to ensure that you have the discriminator set properly. Your supply level seems a little low for the Fusor itself (as Richard stated) and I'm curious whether your tube is operating outside the proportional region. Could you please provide the detector model number (or gas fill parameter and dimensions) along with the bias voltage applied?

It does hurt your claim when you don't have a lot of background info on your project history. Keep pushing toward the end but just be aware that this board is very hesitant to add people to the neutron club in a push button fashion.
Nick Peskosky
NPeskosky@gmail.com

"The whole of science is nothing more than the refinement of everyday thinking." - Albert Einstein

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Zan_Chaudhry
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Re: Neutron Club Application- Zan Chaudhry

Post by Zan_Chaudhry » Fri May 20, 2016 5:44 pm

I'll try and see if I can use a gamma source from the nuclear medicine department of the hospital where my mom works. The voltage range is really high, from 2000-2800, and I run it at 2000. There's basically no information on the tube except for Operating voltage, model number, and the text neutron detector in Russian, and the model number, CH19H, does not turn up any results online.The tube is about 7.75 in. long and 1.25 in. diameter. I bought it off of eBay about a year ago. The background count that I reported was with the tube out of the moderator, however in the moderator the count was very similar. And again, I'm really sorry for not joining earlier.I'll do all I can to satisfy the board.

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Richard Hull
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Re: Neutron Club Application- Zan Chaudhry

Post by Richard Hull » Fri May 20, 2016 10:03 pm

Nick is correct. You need to get your neutron counter working and not cutting off. No properly configured neutron counter ever just cuts off.

I operate a Reuter & Stokes, 23 inch, 4 atm.,3He tube and its bias is on the order of 1600 volts. The background here varies from 6-9 counts per minute. (cosmic radiation).

You need to
1. Get you counter working full time, properly biased and level discrimenated to count only neutrons
2. Take a background count over a period of ten minutes and then divide by ten to get your background CPM.
3. Run your fusor with the tube out of its moderator for 5 minutes - moderator not near the tube. report you counts per minute
4. Re-Run the fusor with the tube inside the moderator for 5 minutes and report your CPM.

I think you will find that once all is working well, that at 19kv, you will have to do a bit of statistics to prove you are doing fusion. You have a great tube, I think. It is far better than most ever have in their fusion quest, but it does take a bit of electronic shepherding to make it work within its design regime.

You probably should have joined a bit sooner to give us a bit of background on your effort as you went along. You are the very first person to ever show up here claiming a win in your first posting. It is only natural that your claims are looked at somewhat ascance by many old hands here. Russion made tubes are notoriously tough to get results from.

Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
Retired now...Doing only what I want and not what I should...every day is a saturday.

Jim Stead
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Re: Neutron Club Application- Zan Chaudhry

Post by Jim Stead » Fri May 20, 2016 10:07 pm

I believe that first H in your tube model number is actually a Russian character that looks like a backwards N
Carl Willis posted info and a link to the specs for the tube you have - viewtopic.php?f=13&t=6196#p41096

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Richard Hull
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Re: Neutron Club Application- Zan Chaudhry

Post by Richard Hull » Fri May 20, 2016 10:26 pm

Thanks Jim for finding this older posting. After reading it and the comments made by Doug Coulter, who claims experience with it, it sounds like a tube that needs a rather experienced hand to bring into useful and continued operation. Hopefully, someone with a small but stable neutron source.

A number of boron lined tubes are also famous for requiring an "experienced hand" to bring to heel in reliably counting neutrons.

But then all neutron counter tubes are not a simple thing for a rank amatuer with no electronics and specifically nuclear instrumention electronics experience to make a good, reliable neutron counter. I considered myself rather experienced and spent about 2 hours with a scope and neutron source to bring my preamp and NIM modules to the point of warranting only neutrons were counted.

Rolling your own neutron counter even with a good tube can be daunting for the amateur.

Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
Retired now...Doing only what I want and not what I should...every day is a saturday.

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Zan_Chaudhry
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Location: Ellicott City, MD, USA

Re: Neutron Club Application- Zan Chaudhry

Post by Zan_Chaudhry » Fri May 20, 2016 11:18 pm

Again, I'm really sorry for not joining earlier. I've been using fusor.net for a while, actually, and I found answers to all of my specific problems here. I never thought about joining because I was somewhat intimidated due to my lack of experience. I kept track of all of my progresses (and sadly, my failures too :(), and I'll work on compiling them to give the board all of my background (This includes 10's of pictures/videos). And I also have all of my purchases documented with a timeline. I really appreciate your guidance with my detector, and I'll follow through with everyone's advice. Also, thanks to Mr. Stead for noticing my model number and sharing the previous post with the specs.

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