Interesting idea for a fusion power plant

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John Taylor
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Interesting idea for a fusion power plant

Post by John Taylor » Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:10 pm

The other night I was looking through the 1966 edition of "Introduction to Nuclear Physics" by Harald A. Enge of MIT. I found the following humorous idea for a fusion-based steam generating plant:

"On a very large scale, it is possible to use the catastrophic process in a semi-controlled manner, and this possibility has been seriously looked into. A large canyon could be lined with concrete and fitted with a concrete roof so as to produce a giant steam boiler. Once every hour or so, a hydrogen bomb could be detonated inside the boiler so as to produce enough steam for an hour's consumption. This may be a last-resort scheme for the peaceful use of fusion energy; it obviously would be much more attractive if the gas in which the fusion reaction takes place could be contained in a controlled manner at the high temperatures involved."

WOW!!! This came from a respected physicist of the time and was in an introductory nuclear physics text. I saw this and just had to share it.

John Taylor

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Chris Bradley
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Re: Interesting idea for a fusion power plant

Post by Chris Bradley » Fri Jan 27, 2012 8:19 pm

Project Gnome was a test of this principle (not quite a whole canyon, but in a layer of salt). I previously listed Project Gnome (a Plowshare experiment) as a fusion technology in my list here, but deleted it because it later appeared that was done with fission devices. I am not aware that this was ever tried in Plowshare with thermonuclear devices, but the idea has been around [I guess] since Teller started looking for new ways to sell 'The Bomb' to the public.

Info on Gnome:

http://www.osti.gov/bridge/servlets/pur ... 612556.pdf

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Doug Coulter
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Re: Interesting idea for a fusion power plant

Post by Doug Coulter » Fri Jan 27, 2012 11:25 pm

Geothermal the difficult and expensive way! Make your own hot rocks at great expense!
Why guess when you can know? Measure!

ab0032
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Re: Interesting idea for a fusion power plant

Post by ab0032 » Sat Jan 28, 2012 8:21 pm

It is proof though, that we can use fission to generate energy. It is possible. Can you do Hydrogen - Bor fusion in bombs too?

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John Taylor
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Re: Interesting idea for a fusion power plant

Post by John Taylor » Sat Jan 28, 2012 11:15 pm

The hydrogen bomb uses fission to initiate a much more powerful fusion reaction in hydrogen isotopes. To use Boron in such a device would be very difficult and the VERY low efficiency of the Proton-Boron reaction would not be likely to improve the yield appreciably.

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Re: Interesting idea for a fusion power plant

Post by Miras Absar » Tue Feb 28, 2012 5:38 am

You propose an interesting idea. I have been looking into a similar idea for a long time, and I think I've come up with a feasible fusion environment. I host my project at

Administrator’s note: Mr. Absar can’t figure out if he wants to discuss his own project on Fusor.net. He wants to discuss it and he wants our feedback. But on the other hand, he doesn’t want to discuss it, because it is “classified” (see below).
Readers are referred to the forum guidelines:

>“Unwelcome contributions include: […] references to ideas that members intend to keep secret”

When Mr. Absar’s project becomes "declassified," he will be able to discuss it and the original text of his message will be restored.

A Footnote: The reason why Aura is classified is due to its high energy density. Off of 1 mole of fuel (water aka di-hydrogen-1 mono-oxide-16), Aura can produce ~1 gigawatt of power, meaning that if someone successfully triggers a large Aura reaction, with even 1 mole of fuel, with insufficient cooling, the results would be a small thermonuclear explosion.

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Carl Willis
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Re: Interesting idea for a fusion power plant

Post by Carl Willis » Tue Feb 28, 2012 6:35 am

What's unclear to me is

(A) why this comes up here if it can't be discussed. Someone (obviously not a national government) has "classified" your project. This is an "open-source" forum. Sit back for two seconds and ponder the incongruity.

(B) why this comes up in someone else's thread. Thread hijacking is bad manners. Get your own thread. But only if you plan on discussing something compatible with this site (i.e., not "classified").

-Carl
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Miras Absar
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Re: Interesting idea for a fusion power plant

Post by Miras Absar » Tue Feb 28, 2012 6:48 am

I see your point Carl, and it is well understood. I understand that this is an "Open Source" forum, so you've got me there. My only defense here is, I would hate to be a cause of a fusor accident, as unlikely as it may seem. As for coming up in this thread, take a look at what was originally proposed in this thread, and compare it to what I have proposed. I think you will find a striking similarity.

I appreciate the feedback!
Best Wishes!

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Carl Willis
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Re: Interesting idea for a fusion power plant

Post by Carl Willis » Tue Feb 28, 2012 6:55 am

You understand my point, and yet you still want me (and everyone else) to read your link and discuss it.

In other words, you do not understand my point.

Let's fix this problem in the next hour before I go to bed. Or I will repair it.

EDIT: Mr. Absar has decided to keep his ideas secret, and I am off to bed.

-Carl
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John Taylor
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Re: Interesting idea for a fusion power plant

Post by John Taylor » Tue Feb 28, 2012 10:02 am

To Mr Absar:
Concerning your posting "You propose an interesting idea. I have been looking into a similar idea for a long time, and I think I've come up with a feasible fusion environment. I host my project at..."

This was not a proposal by me or anyone on this forum, it was in a 40+ year old physics text by a respected physicist and I found it humorous and passed it on for its entertainment value only. Although it is possible to use this as a means of generating useful forms of energy from nuclear processes, it is absolutely NOT prudent or even wise by my thinking.

Whatever your project is, if you can discuss it I'm sure we would all love to see it. If it can't be discussed for whatever reason (classified, dangerous,...) it shouldn't be brought up here because most members are probably not going to like that and secrecy doesn't go along with the spirit of this forum.

John Taylor

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