Fusor theory variant on arxiv.. EV Tsiper

It may be difficult to separate "theory" from "application," but let''s see if this helps facilitate the discussion.
RobertBryant
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Re: Fusor theory variant on arxiv.. EV Tsiper

Post by RobertBryant » Tue Jun 02, 2020 6:11 am

deleted
Last edited by RobertBryant on Tue Jun 02, 2020 6:26 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Richard Hull
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Re: Fusor theory variant on arxiv.. EV Tsiper

Post by Richard Hull » Tue Jun 02, 2020 6:33 am

Robert, you had two copies of your post here. This sometimes happens. When I see there are two copies of the same post, I delete one of the copies. To my amazement, both copies disappeared! Likewise, when I do delete a copy, I have never see a notice appear on the board that it is deleted as in this case! This has never happened. I am sorry. Note, sometimes when you hit submit and it does not seem to take, do not hit submit again until you wait a while as a second hit on submit might post two identical posts. Again, I am very sorry.

Please! will some of the other admins look to see if they have changed, in the last two weeks, the deletion methodology to where identical posts will delete both with the same text instead of just the one selected for deletion and then log it as a permanent post saying deleted??? I have never seen this happen!!! Usually I select the duplicate for deletion, it is deleted and the other remains as posted, with no deletion notice posted.

Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
Retired now...Doing only what I want and not what I should...every day is a saturday.

RobertBryant
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Re: Fusor theory variant on arxiv.. EV Tsiper

Post by RobertBryant » Wed Jun 03, 2020 12:02 am

no worries..
Kia Ora.. mea culpa
Nzers pride themselves on Kiwi ingenuity..
I don't think a turbo pump is gonna last long when I start playing around with it..:)

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Richard Hull
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Re: Fusor theory variant on arxiv.. EV Tsiper

Post by Richard Hull » Wed Jun 03, 2020 3:38 am

I hope if you do play with a turbo pump, it survives longer than mine did in my recent fusor effort. It amazes me how they can be both wonderful and evil at the same time. Of course we do play rough with them.

Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
Retired now...Doing only what I want and not what I should...every day is a saturday.

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Dennis P Brown
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Re: Fusor theory variant on arxiv.. EV Tsiper

Post by Dennis P Brown » Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:01 am

Turbo's are extremely complex electrical and mechanical devices that are very delicate; I've rebuilt a few fan blade systems after debris (bolts) have fallen in. For me, the worse aspect is the electronic sections since they are complex and not easy to fix - and even with schematics the over-riding issue (for me, at least) is that since most parts are highly specialized, there isn't an easy way to replace most of these electronic parts (for this reason, I keep an old, simi-working driver module just in case for that very reason - ebay had a great deal once so I jumped on it); worse about these units I see is that they apparently do not handle high voltage plasma flash overs very well - as Richard will attest to.

I've always used a water cooled DP for my fusor; my turbo was reserved only for high vac projects (more for cleanliness till I read of Richard's mishap - now I really won't consider any fusor app.) So independent grounding (no star mode) and throat screening alone isn't going to guarentee safety, I guess - I did provided these features to my turbo system but partly out of habit, not out of any real concern.

I guess those that do use turbo's in fusors have other methods, maybe? Distance alone, maybe?

By the way, I do not use a trap on my DP and my fusor worked fine (apparently the manual gate valve does most of that screening, I guess.)

Enough derailing of this thred on my part - back to the regularly scheduled post ... ;)

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Richard Hull
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Re: Fusor theory variant on arxiv.. EV Tsiper

Post by Richard Hull » Wed Jun 03, 2020 10:12 pm

Yes, for fusor work, a fore line trap or any form of trap is never needed if proper procedures are used in the construction and operation of the vacuum system.

Richard Hull
Progress may have been a good thing once, but it just went on too long. - Yogi Berra
Fusion is the energy of the future....and it always will be
Retired now...Doing only what I want and not what I should...every day is a saturday.

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Bob Reite
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Re: Fusor theory variant on arxiv.. EV Tsiper

Post by Bob Reite » Thu Jun 04, 2020 12:37 am

I've had to replace once and repair once the turbo controller but the failure was never related to arc over from the fusor HV supply. The bad failure was overnight when I had the turbo idling in standby mode in preparation for a run the following day. A capacitor shorted at a high current point in the circuit board, burning up the board traces before any fuses blew. I found an identical replacement controller on EBay. The second time the controller failed on startup. This time the line fuse blew. Not just an overload but a dead short telling from what the fuse looked liked. I suspected the bridge rectifier and I was correct. Dead shorted. A new rectifier and fuse restored operation.

If one implements a star grounding system correctly, preferably defining the chamber shell as the star point, there should not be any vacuum system failures related to fusor arc overs.
The more reactive the materials, the more spectacular the failures.
The testing isn't over until the prototype is destroyed.

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