Hi
I found a transformer that is cheap enough for me and I wanted to ask you about it. It's F.A.R.T. transformer 4000V/25mA, so is it enough for fusor to work in star mode? I could buy two but I'm not sure if I can connect them in parallel to get more mA from them?
Transformer
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Chris Trent
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Re: Transformer
Depends on what you want to do.
I would recommend the following FAQs for further reading.
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=2569&hilit=FAQ#p12079
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=2674&hilit=FAQ+Demo#p12184
I would recommend the following FAQs for further reading.
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=2569&hilit=FAQ#p12079
viewtopic.php?f=24&t=2674&hilit=FAQ+Demo#p12184
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John Futter
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Re: Transformer
Please re-read the "Please introduce yourself" Forum
Re: Transformer
I don't know what you mean, I introduced myself... viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1873#p9094
Re: Transformer
OK
I have read FAQ and I have few questions. According to FAQ I can choose any transformer - It doesn't have to have secondary current 60mA? I plan to build only demo fusor.
I have read FAQ and I have few questions. According to FAQ I can choose any transformer - It doesn't have to have secondary current 60mA? I plan to build only demo fusor.
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Chris Bradley
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Re: Transformer
Ah! The quality of dialogue we get on the boards these days!
...If all the threads have to be about practical fusor building then what else are we to expect anymore except for newbs asking basic hardware questions about fusor building??
If this isn't down to the discouragement of detailed theoretical discussions on the merits of argued speculations on fusor and other fusion sciences - so as to maintain a current stream of erudite discussions that might terrify the newbs into being very cautious about asking questions in the first place - then what is it down to?
...If all the threads have to be about practical fusor building then what else are we to expect anymore except for newbs asking basic hardware questions about fusor building??
If this isn't down to the discouragement of detailed theoretical discussions on the merits of argued speculations on fusor and other fusion sciences - so as to maintain a current stream of erudite discussions that might terrify the newbs into being very cautious about asking questions in the first place - then what is it down to?
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Chris Trent
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Re: Transformer
I appreciate you correcting your name, Thank you. Please add your last name too when you have a chance.
As far as transformers go, it sounds promising so far. I don't know enough about that model to tell though.
Search for "Neon Sign Transformer" and you'll find a few hundred posts on the subject.
Just about every aspect of the Fusor had been discussed at great length here at one point or another. You literally have months of reading to do here if you're so inclined.
As far as transformers go, it sounds promising so far. I don't know enough about that model to tell though.
Search for "Neon Sign Transformer" and you'll find a few hundred posts on the subject.
Just about every aspect of the Fusor had been discussed at great length here at one point or another. You literally have months of reading to do here if you're so inclined.
Re: Transformer
I don't know what did you want me to ask you...I don't know theory of fusor enough to talk about details with you. After all, I haven't done this before. I'm interested in theory but I didn't have time to study it entirely.
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Chris Bradley
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Re: Transformer
Don't panic, Mario. It was not a comment aimed at you.
Y'see, a year or two back, the forum pages were filled with folks discussing this-or-that to a high degree of scientific depth, albeit speculative on occasions. So when a newb came along, they'd see all this high-brow chit-chat going on in the 'Recent Posts'. I am speculating, in the post above, that it was because of this that they typically started off by apologising for not having very interesting questions to ask and that they took months before building up courage to post anything.
The way the forum has been moderated of late, it is now totally and solely dedicated to practical efforts, and as such for most of the last year we get questions like yours which are already answered several times over within the forum somewhere. But when you come on, all you see is a load of newbs also asking basic questions like this, so you can hardly be blamed for being likely to do the same, rather than take months to hunt down the answer for yourself for fear of asking such an elementary question.
Similarly, there seem to be quite a few folks who are 'doing fusors' all on their own these days without any desire to post here. Some do, once they've finished and are already on their way to a Microsoft expo, others we only find out about because they were photographed by the press explaining their project to POTUS. These are folks pulling 'big-tickets' that this forum is missing out on. I get the impression that posting on this forum used to be, but is no longer, the first port-of-call for someone wanting to progress a fusor project. Is my perception correct, and if so, why is it so?
Just to show no hard feeling to your question - you only need a few hundred volts to get a plasma going, so just get what you can afford and try it. You'll figure out what you need to buy next (and whether you can afford it) soon enough. Just try stuff, see if it works, try again, repeat from step 1.
Y'see, a year or two back, the forum pages were filled with folks discussing this-or-that to a high degree of scientific depth, albeit speculative on occasions. So when a newb came along, they'd see all this high-brow chit-chat going on in the 'Recent Posts'. I am speculating, in the post above, that it was because of this that they typically started off by apologising for not having very interesting questions to ask and that they took months before building up courage to post anything.
The way the forum has been moderated of late, it is now totally and solely dedicated to practical efforts, and as such for most of the last year we get questions like yours which are already answered several times over within the forum somewhere. But when you come on, all you see is a load of newbs also asking basic questions like this, so you can hardly be blamed for being likely to do the same, rather than take months to hunt down the answer for yourself for fear of asking such an elementary question.
Similarly, there seem to be quite a few folks who are 'doing fusors' all on their own these days without any desire to post here. Some do, once they've finished and are already on their way to a Microsoft expo, others we only find out about because they were photographed by the press explaining their project to POTUS. These are folks pulling 'big-tickets' that this forum is missing out on. I get the impression that posting on this forum used to be, but is no longer, the first port-of-call for someone wanting to progress a fusor project. Is my perception correct, and if so, why is it so?
Just to show no hard feeling to your question - you only need a few hundred volts to get a plasma going, so just get what you can afford and try it. You'll figure out what you need to buy next (and whether you can afford it) soon enough. Just try stuff, see if it works, try again, repeat from step 1.
Re: Transformer
Yeah, I should have searched for answers myself. Thanks for your answer, I guess I have a day full of reading about fusor.
And I'm not really a newb, I have done Tesla coil before , it's just that I want to build it before learning all that theory.
And I'm not really a newb, I have done Tesla coil before , it's just that I want to build it before learning all that theory.
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chad ramey
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Re: Transformer
With all due respect Chris Bradley, you are just as much contributing to the degradation of this forum when you do not abide by its rules. If you wish to complain about something, take it up in a separate thread or with one of our many moderators.
-Chad
-Chad
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Chris Trent
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Re: Transformer
Sorry Mario,
I wasn't trying to give you a hard time. We've had a lot of people come and go over the years and one thing that I've noticed is that the people who actually complete something around here are the ones that do the search on their own. Maybe it's something about personality and perseverance; I don't really know.
The other Chris is right though, there is more than enough information here now to create a Fusor without ever talking to anyone. More and more people are doing that but I'd personally prefer that you ask questions. That's how we all learn.
-Chris T
I wasn't trying to give you a hard time. We've had a lot of people come and go over the years and one thing that I've noticed is that the people who actually complete something around here are the ones that do the search on their own. Maybe it's something about personality and perseverance; I don't really know.
The other Chris is right though, there is more than enough information here now to create a Fusor without ever talking to anyone. More and more people are doing that but I'd personally prefer that you ask questions. That's how we all learn.
-Chris T
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RobertTubbs
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Re: Transformer
First and foremost, yes it will do startmode, hell, it could do detectable fusion if you put a voltage multiplication circuit on the end of it...
You would have learned this had you read through the forums before posting, everyone makes this mistake, learn from it and get with the times.
This thread is now pointless and and deserves no further bumps, let it die.
-RT
You would have learned this had you read through the forums before posting, everyone makes this mistake, learn from it and get with the times.
This thread is now pointless and and deserves no further bumps, let it die.
-RT
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Dan Tibbets
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Re: Transformer
What does F.A.R.T. stand for?
As far as 4000V and 25 mA, this is plenty for demo fusors. I have found, that depending on vacuum, the plasma will start/ light up at anywhere from ~ 250-300 V to ~ 14,000V. This is my record for my best vacuum condition, a ~1 qt jar and a mechanical pump that achieved ~ 5-7 microns, at least untill the plasma lit, then the vacuum would quickly jump to ~ 20-40 microns (due possibly to the pump clearing gasses only very slowly at these pressures and the present of plastics that probably out gas enthusiastically under any plasma particle bombardment).
If this transformer is current limited to ~ 25 mA its actual voltage output may be ~ 2500 V AC at ~ 16 mA of current (See R Hull's discussion of NST transformers and current limiting).
If you use a voltage tripler ( to boost the DC voltage to ~ 16,000 V ) the current would drop by a factor of 3 to ~ 8mA at full rating. Using R Hull's rule of thirds (essentially 2/3rds of rated current will result in ~ 1/3rd drop in rated voltage in current limited transformers.
Then of coures you have to figure the voltage drop through voltage multipliers. In short I doubt this transformer would suffice for measurable deuterium fusion. I suspect two of them hooked up in parellel would not suffice.
Now if you had a 60 mA 15,000 V NST with a single stage full wave voltage doubler, you might just get buy, tough I have read that this is marginal at best and would require good chamber and detection equipment to compensate.
In short, such a transformer as you mention should work for demo fusors, and development work, but you would need to graduate to a more capable power supply if you wished to join the neutron club.
And, 5-10 mA of current is plenty to generate a moderatly bright glow discharge.
Another issue may be if the transformer has ground fault interruption built into it. This may cause headaches.
Dan Tibbets
As far as 4000V and 25 mA, this is plenty for demo fusors. I have found, that depending on vacuum, the plasma will start/ light up at anywhere from ~ 250-300 V to ~ 14,000V. This is my record for my best vacuum condition, a ~1 qt jar and a mechanical pump that achieved ~ 5-7 microns, at least untill the plasma lit, then the vacuum would quickly jump to ~ 20-40 microns (due possibly to the pump clearing gasses only very slowly at these pressures and the present of plastics that probably out gas enthusiastically under any plasma particle bombardment).
If this transformer is current limited to ~ 25 mA its actual voltage output may be ~ 2500 V AC at ~ 16 mA of current (See R Hull's discussion of NST transformers and current limiting).
If you use a voltage tripler ( to boost the DC voltage to ~ 16,000 V ) the current would drop by a factor of 3 to ~ 8mA at full rating. Using R Hull's rule of thirds (essentially 2/3rds of rated current will result in ~ 1/3rd drop in rated voltage in current limited transformers.
Then of coures you have to figure the voltage drop through voltage multipliers. In short I doubt this transformer would suffice for measurable deuterium fusion. I suspect two of them hooked up in parellel would not suffice.
Now if you had a 60 mA 15,000 V NST with a single stage full wave voltage doubler, you might just get buy, tough I have read that this is marginal at best and would require good chamber and detection equipment to compensate.
In short, such a transformer as you mention should work for demo fusors, and development work, but you would need to graduate to a more capable power supply if you wished to join the neutron club.
And, 5-10 mA of current is plenty to generate a moderatly bright glow discharge.
Another issue may be if the transformer has ground fault interruption built into it. This may cause headaches.
Dan Tibbets